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Leiywens' MS thread (retired thread)

Discussion in 'MS' started by Drew, May 12, 2017.

  1. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    This is not about my FISS build, but if you've seen the damper thread, I posted about this FISS with Steering.

    [​IMG]

    It's been rattling around in my head on how this is achieved and I think I finally worked out the magic.
    As you will have seen in my previous post, I picked up a steering kit to figure out exactly how it works in hopes of working out how it's been modded to work on this FISS build. So I started by building it up to see how it fits together and works.

    [​IMG]

    Now I can see how the steering works, I needed to compare it to the image above. There were 3 things that I was curious about.

    [​IMG]

    The blue pill is the swing arm, I couldn't for the life of me figure out where he found that piece, whether it was a part, or like the other swingarms, which bumper it might be part of. Well, if I'm correct, this is the roller mount section of this bumper: Tamiya #15412 JR Rein Rr Double Roller Stay.
    The orange I was trying to figure out where the small rubber tube was from. I know it's not the one that's given to use on Stabcaps, that one was too big. Well after opening the MS Brake set, I found it comes with a little rubber tube that slots onto the shaft. I think it's used to allow the frp that holds the steering control in place to flex a little so the steering control can pivot freely.
    This brings me to the biggest mystery. The green box. If you've seen the small YT vid, you'll notice he's not used the wheels that come with the steering set, instead using the one-way wheel system. What really bugged me, is if you're not using the wheel kit that builds up as part of the steering kit, how can you have a single position wheel mounted in such a way as it could pivot. Looking back and forth between the image and the kit in my hand, I came to realise that the answer was obvious all along. The steering control is replacing the "upright mount" that you'd use in a static wheel position. How does it pivot? Well looking closer at the image, I could see the car is using the wishbone or maybe a universal joint method with the cup nestled just inside the steering control. The cup and dockbone allow the wheel to pivot and maintain the position of the wheel with it's mounting.

    Hmmm...now I'm not sure if you're following, but here's a few pictures to help explain.
    We need this part with it's bushing.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    And when replacing the "upright mount" with the steering control mount, it should look something like this. It's correct position should have the arm forward while the 2 stubs (left/right) should be top and bottom.

    [​IMG]

    The steering control should sit as close to the dock rod as possible to allow the best for the best movement. So the cup should sit inside the control upto the point where it doesn't interfere with the pins of the dock rod.
    To actuate the steering is actually pretty simple. You use a sliding damper and make a mount frp that will attach to the sliding damper and have a slot mounting point for the steering control arm to slip into.

    Now that I know how it's done, maybe sometime in the future I will attempt another FISS build this time with the steering. But for now, it's best to take it one step at a time and fine tune my V1 FISS to gain further understanding on the build and how to make it tidy and more efficient.
    I will begin working on that again tomorrow. Look forward to more posts.
     
  2. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    Back again....been working on the FISS again, also cutting the frp for the leo.
    I've been able to get the front top swing arms mounted, later I'll work on the front lower swing arms.

    To begin with, I ordered 5 packets of the MS brake set. All that was needed is this part:
    20170719_164114.jpg
    20170719_164148.jpg

    Need the ends for the actual swing arm mount. The yellow piece is kept and will have holes drilled in to make a reinforcing plate.
    When it's assembled, it should look something like this although I'd only done one side before I took the photo.
    20170719_173130.jpg 20170719_173138.jpg

    I did a test mount, before building the other side and mounting the whole section.
    20170719_173212.jpg 20170719_173212.jpg
    Here's the full front top swing arm mount.
    20170719_180955.jpg
    I know, the plate came out a little crooked, but it does what is needed and is clear of the gear. The swing arms move freely and I've added back the shock absorber.
    Just need to do the other 3 and hopefully I get it right this time and everything lines up better. Will probably take me a day or 2 to finish this part.

    On another note, you might remember I got the Savannah Leo for another project. I've got most of the parts, still waiting on a couple more bits before I can go full out and finish building it. But for now, most of it has been cut, the frp have been cut to shape, I've built the rear stay and rollers, the front stay is not secured correctly right now as I'm still waiting the final parts.
    But, I've mostly put it together so everyone can see how it's coming along.
    I've already made photos of each stage ready to upload, but I'll do it in a single go....I hope to anyway.
    Anyhow, here's an image of how it looks right now. Enjoy.

    20170719_184854.jpg
     
  3. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    Do I have a treat for you guys.:cool:

    So with the rebuild of the V1 underway, I've spent most of yesterday and couple hours today so far and have mounted 1 wheel and had a motorised test. Here's a few pics.

    Topside.
    20170720_160319.jpg

    Front.
    20170720_160336.jpg
    Underside.
    20170720_160346.jpg

    There's a lot less modification needed if you were to reverse the swing arm mounting points so the underside is on the front screws and the top side is on the back screws. But I was already committed to a specific aesthetic so had to modify for this build.
    I've also had to change the wheels as the low profile just didn't give enough clearance, so I've just thrown on some large diameter but haven't trimmed them....yet! Will finis building and see what happens first.
    If or when I make a V2, I will do the easier way. Still haven't attached the spring yet, was going to do that after this post.

    So for the finale to this post, here's a vid of the motorised test. Enjoy! I sure did :D

     
  4. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    Was working on it again today, finished all the wheel mounts, unfortunately, most of the dock rods shook their pins out, so I need to fix that later before I can show it running. A couple other things, I need to shorten the front stay, I just haphazardly attached it like so after I had to change the wheels for large diameter for better clearance. The wheel base width needs to be reduced drastically, increased width causes less ground clearance.

    There's definitely a lot of room for tweaks right now, shorten the dock rods a bit more, reduce the wheel base width with either or all of replacing the wide tread upright for normal tread upright, mount the upright on the shorter hole on the swing arms and trim the inside of the wheel again so it cups the upright and need to think about the front stay and damper.

    Anyway, a few pics. I'll make videos later after getting dock rod pins sorted again. Or maybe after more tweaks.
    There is one major point I want to highlight. I think it would be better to actually build FISS with MSUD (MS upside down) as it gives an extra 1-2mm extra ground clearance on the chassis but also because if I'm not mistaken, the axle hole also sits a touch higher on the chassis. By doing this, you'll have more build space on the underside to have better ground clearance. I'll most likely do this if/when I do a V.2

    20170721_224639.jpg
    20170721_224653.jpg
    20170721_224707.jpg
     
  5. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    So here it is. Not nearly as good as I'd planned on building, but I was both stubborn and wanted to just get it working. I've already got ideas on how to improve it with a v2, but haven't decided if I'll tear this one down or build a new one from scratch.

    Anyway, I'm sure you're all excited to see it so here it is.

    20170723_145122.jpg 20170723_145314.jpg 20170723_145347.jpg 20170723_145411.jpg 20170723_145457.jpg 20170723_145615.jpg 20170723_145730.jpg 20170723_145713.jpg 20170723_145645.jpg 20170723_145730b.jpg 20170723_145746.jpg 20170723_145758.jpg







    It's been a very interesting build, much fun and much frustration, a lot of time waiting on parts and a lot of time destroying parts. Ultimately, I got there in the end. The build quality isn't so good, but with a full working build, making a v.2 will be so much easier with the knowledge gained from this build.

    As you guys might know, I've also got the SavLeo build on the go also, that is waiting on 2 more parts and I'll be able to finish building it, so look forward to seeing that. It's a very tidy and neatly made build compared to this mess!

    Time now for a hard earned rest.
    Later.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2017
  6. MrBot

    MrBot Screw

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    What a great post this one is. Thank you. I have been wanting to do suspension but I am curious on a few things first:
    What is the travel you are getting in the suspension?
    Do the gears lock when fully compressed and running?
    Also does your chassis still stay above the 1 mm clearance when suspension is compressed?

    Once again great stuff.

    Thank you
     
  7. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    I'll be honest, I've already stripped down this build since it was meant for learning, I may remake it in the future (I've saved the main parts for it). Anyway, as to your questions.

    1) Plenty of travel, in fact it's too much unless you add a mechanism for shortening the travel range, use a shorter shock rod or add 1.5/3mm spacers to limit range.

    2) No, only when the wheels lock will the gears lock. It's full wishbone suspension, so no matter how the suspension actuates, the gears won't lock.

    3)Basically refer to answer for question 1. Depending on how you set it up, the build can bottom out on the track but if you adjust it correctly, it will always have clearance.

    Don't forget to check out some of the other threads with suspension ideas, there's the stickied post for building simple MS suspension, I've made a couple others for both MS and MA chassis, I'm also working on a cross chassis compatible suspension build (AR, SFM, FM-A, VS, MS, MA....etc), you might want to check it out in the AR section.
     
  8. MrBot

    MrBot Screw

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    Sorry I was meaning your more basic suspension. The one with 4 x threaded rods for front and rear.
     
  9. Drew

    Drew Carbon Fiber Dust

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    Pretty much the same answers to each of your questions :D
    Except it won't bottom out on the track.
     
    MrBot likes this.

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